123-Reg Reviews

About 123-Reg

123-Reg is a UK-based company that provides domain registration and web hosting services. The company was founded in 2000 and has since become one of the largest domain registrars in the UK, serving over 1.7 million domains. So it doesn’t matter if you’re just starting out or whether you are a savvy developer, 123-Reg will have a plan to suit your requirements.

Over the years 123-Reg has grown its product range to offer a whole host of online business solutions, ranging from Office 365 to Email. Including a whole range of web hosting services, from standard web hosting, and WordPress hosting to premium and even virtual private server (VPS) hosting.

In addition, they also offer website builder tools and eCommerce solutions for customers who want to create and manage their online stores.

123-Reg was previously owned by Host Europe Group, but in 2017, Host Europe Group was acquired by GoDaddy, a US-based company that provides domain registration, web hosting, and related services. As a result, 123-Reg is now owned by GoDaddy. However, the 123-Reg brand continues to operate independently in the UK, and customers can still purchase domain registration and web hosting services directly from the 123-Reg website.

Services Offered By 123-Reg

As we mentioned at the top of this review, 123-Reg offers a wide range of web services to get your website online.

Domain Registration Services: 123 Reg’s domain registration services are what the company are best known for and are the UK’s leading domain registration provider. With a 123 Reg domain, you will get free email forwarding and complete DNS management for your domain name. 123-Reg offer some great introductory pricing, however, renewals tend to be more expensive than other providers out there. 

Web Hosting: 123-Reg offers a range of web hosting services, including shared hosting, VPS hosting, and dedicated servers. These services provide customers with the space and resources needed to host their website online. It is worth noting that their shared hosting requires a minimum contract term of 36 months.

Website builder: 123-Reg’s website builder allows customers to create and design their own website using a simple drag-and-drop interface. This is a great option for those who don’t have web development experience. Their site builder packages also includes a domain name, SSL, email hosting and analytics tools.

WordPress Hosting: 123-Reg offers WordPress-specific hosting plans that are optimised for WordPress sites. This includes automatic updates, caching, and more. WordPress hosting is optimised for sites running WordPress and includes a staging site (on Standard Plans and higher) and content delivery network (CDN).

Learn more about UK WordPress Hosting and how it works

eCommerce solutions: 123-Reg offers a range of eCommerce solutions, including online store builders and payment processing services. This allows customers to create and manage their online stores.

Email hosting: 123-Reg provides email hosting services that allow customers to create custom email addresses using their own domain name.

SSL certificates: 123-Reg offers SSL certificates that provide encryption and security for websites. This is particularly important for sites that handle sensitive data.

Data Centres and Network

123-Reg operates multiple data centres in the UK and Europe. The exact locations of their data centres are not publicly disclosed, but they have stated that their facilities are located in geographically dispersed locations for redundancy and security purposes. 

This means that their data centres are designed to provide high levels of uptime and availability for their customers’ websites and applications. Additionally, their data centres are equipped with state-of-the-art security and monitoring systems to ensure the safety and security of their customers’ data.

Related: – Why hosting your website in the UK is important

Shared Hosting

VPS Hosting

great help

I have been with 123 reg for many years now and never had a single problem. They are always help and quick to respond. They are easy to use and navigate. Thank you 123 reg.

Great Value to Start

I signed up with 123-reg when I was just starting out with web construction and hosting for my clients and I found them very helpful. Good value for the money they ask. I’ve never had any problems with uploading my sites, setting up email or transferring in (or out on occasion). I would recommend them for smaller sites certainly, as I have never tried a particularly large site with them. Their telephone support was very good as well as their online help.

Avoid 123 reg

Webmasters be aware. 123-reg is a waste of time and a rip off. I unfortunately decided to host my website www.abcplumbingltd.co.uk with 123-reg. It took 4 hours just for the payment to go through, my bank confirmed that they were returning the payment. After this was done, they said I would receive a free domain, they charged £33.80. which is non refundable. When I try speaking to support team, they stop responding after awhile. I have 7 days so I think I will look for another provider. If you want to avoid all of this, look else where, to host your site.

Warning – Keep away from 123-reg

I have hosted a domain with 123-reg for three years. Their service has gradually deteriorated over time. A year ago my website was hacked despite all security provisions from my side. More recently, their e-mail service has become completely un-usable. I have not been receiving any e-mails sent to me and neither are any mails sent by me getting to the intended recipients. 123-reg have not been helpful at all in solving these problems. Their support service is completely rubbish as they provide standard answers to queries and make no effort to put things back on track. There is never a word of apology from them. There have been many other problems with them so I would like to warn everyone that it is best to avoid them completely. There are much better ISPs around. After getting completely frustrated today I am changing over to another ISP.

the best domain and hosting

123-reg, I have been using the in past few years now, I have tried othere plases for domain, and hosting But there is nothing like 123-reg, help, support. I rate 123-reg 10/10 if you new, I defently sugest 123-reg Its easy Its simple

Unbelievably bad! Avoid!

As I already had the domain name with them I thought it might be simpler to have hosting with them too. Log-in and ftp details were sent promptly but when I tried ot copy files across I got 553-Access denied errors. When I raised a ticket I was told “We were able to log in so there’s no problem”. I asked them to find out what the 553 error was and was then told the ‘predicament’ would have to be delegated upwards and the timeframe for fixing it was unknown but would hopefully not be more than “a few days”! At this point I decided to go back to my previous provider where the problems were trivial by comparison! The support team told me the refund could only be arranged by calling the 0845 premium rate number between 9 & 5.30. I had to call five times before I got the refund. Each call involved about 5 mins of listening to piped music. When I did get through to person, they took a few details and said “Oh now I’m forwarding you to the Customer Relations Dept. which means another five mins on hold. The telephone response menu has 4 options. Once when I got through, I was told I had chosen the wrong menu item and should have selected Customer Relations, even though that was not one of the 4 options!! I was going to file a complaint with ISPA but they are not even members 🙁

Poor Customer service

I only have a number of domain names with 123 reg and updating named servers can now only be done by them because you get a error when you try to do it from the control panel. However the reason I felt I had to write this review is the fact that when you raise a support ticket it takes days and days until you hear back from anyone and when you do its not a great response. They really have become incredibly incompetent with support and their systems so anyone reading this I really would not recommend them at all. Cheers all

123-reg Review

I have been with 123-reg for the last 1 1/2 years. They were fine when i started out, as my site was very simple and I did not need any help. My site now has progressed and I want more than they can offer. There staff are not very helpful if you are new to web design. They talk down to you if you don`t understand and make you feel stupid for asking questions. They limit files sizes and do not give out their phone number, without you first spending ages of your time searching through pages and pages and pages and pages of irrelevant information. Are time has no value!!!

Shared hosting is dreadful

I’ve been very happy with the domain name management side of 123-Reg. It’s only now that I’ve started getting more adventurous with site-building that I see the problems. The bottom line is, the shared hosting servers are just not up to the job. I have several live SQL-based sites that vary through the day from just slow to unusable – once the database is active they’re fine, it’s just the first (crucial) click takes an age to load. Even empty vanilla installations of WordPress or (especially) Joomla are slow! Plain HTML pages are ok, so it’s just the db side of things. I’ve complained, they suggested I take out a VPS service…seriously?

123 reg support team’s patience

I have been with 123 for many years and have always had excellent support. The length of time they stick with you and their patience never ceases to amaze me…what you get with them is the result you want. They’ll have to put up with me for a lot longer yet.

Easy to use, speedy support

I’ve had a web site for a couple of years now, with few problems. It went down once, but reappeared within a couple of hours of me reporting it. The control panel is logical and easy to follow. I recently created two WordPress blogs and was surprised how easy the process was. I bought two additional domains and mapped them onto the blogs, and they now work fine. I had to contact support with a technical question, and got an immediate and helpful response. The whole package offers excellent value for money. The only negative is that the blogs can be a bit sluggish.

A dissapointing service from 123-reg.co.uk

I have to let others know what I have been through for the past 8 days dealing with 123-reg.co.uk support centre. In a simple word: “I wish I had chosen another company” to host my website. I renewed my SSL licence on 20 Feb and immediately after doing so our website was offline. After speaking with 5 support team and also contacting their UK head office and pleading to speak with a senior manager (too busy to talk to his customers!) and being told the site is OK and closing the new tickets when in fact the site was not accessible (if only their support team cleared their cookies and checked my site and tried to navigate then they would have known). What is the point of contacting their support team if they have no interest in the customers business or can’t solve a technical issue and despite of requesting to speak to their manager and being told he is too busy to call customers. I have kept details of all my communications with their support team and happy to supply if needed BUT, please do yourself a big favour and select another company to host your website.

Poor payment method

Unfortuntely I continually have problems with paying for new domains. Renewals is OK (ish) although errors creep in with updating details (IE they dont update, and then the domain renews automatically). The customer service is helpful, but only to a point. And I have been left out of pocket (unrefunded) with domains that should not have renewed, but did. Personally I also find the website is badly laid out and not easy to navigate. Please note this isnt a host feedback, but a domain registrar feedback.

123-reg Worst Hosting Company Ever!

I signed up with 123-reg.co.uk in February 2011. I was looking for UK hosting and found them and thought i would give it a try. The first website I tried to setup with 123-reg was a nightmare. Other hosting companies install wordpress directly to the root directory but now 123-reg. They can onyl install to a directory so the website appears as www.domain.com/wordpress instead of www.domain.com. So I asked 123-reg if they could sort it out. Their reply was “sorry but we don’t give support to 3rd party applications”. This annoyed me as I spent hours and hours finding out how to give wordpress it’s own directory and after a few days I had sorted it out on my own. Thanks for the great customer support 123-reg! So I uploaded all my content and away i go i thought. Well it took between 10-15 seconds for my site to load. No wonder my google analytics showed a 90% bounce rate! No one wants to wait that long for a website to load. Again I spoke to 123-reg for help and they said that as wordpress is a 3rd party application they can’t be responsible if it runs slowly on their servers. Why give wordpress as a free “click-to-install” program if it doesn’t work?! So I decided to look elsewhere and have found a company called hostpapa which is based in the UK. WordPress runs perfectly and my websites load within 1-3 secs maximum. My biggest regret with 123-reg? Well it would be the 3 years worth of hosting I bought in advance at a cost of £300 plus the £200 worth of domains I bought with them. Do yourself a favour and stay away from 123-reg.co.uk. Unless of course you want to throw money down the drain. Save yourself the stress and go with a decent uk hosting company. Check out http://www.hostratings.co.uk/ and you will see that out of all the hosting companies HostPapa comes top and 123-reg bottom. My best advice is buy one month hosting with different hosting companies and see which is the best and easiest to setup a website. I should have followed common sense and done that originally. I would have saved myself a lot of “hair pulling out” days. Hope everyone takes notice of my review and I hope you enjoy building your website and having hassle-free hosting! 🙂

Terrible

I signed up with 123-reg because I’d registered the domain with them and thought it easiest to buy hosting all in one package. Big mistake. I noticed that it was difficult to access the admin portal when editing the site and that the pages were often down when I went to review my changes. I went to Site Confidence who operate an external performance and availability monitor which revealed the shocking truth that my site, with 123-reg, was down or inaccessible for 37% of the time over an entire week!! I told 123-reg who offered to put me on another server, but there was no change in performance or availability. They’ve refunded me (only after providing them with proof of the performance from Site Confidence though!) and I have since joined up with Hostpapa who seem very good so far. Avoid 123-reg like the plague if you’re running any type of commercial operation, as the downtime is, quite frankly, embarrassing to you and 123-reg.

I’ve had great support.

I have had great support from 123-reg. They were quick, knowledgeable and helpful. I purchase domains from them but use hosting elsewhere for no other reason than I don’t like the idea of any one operator having both my domains and hosting, nothing personally to do with 123-reg…

Shockingly bad service from 123-Reg

I am compeled to write this review because I am totally appalled at the customer service at 123-Reg. I have been a loyal customer of theirs for many years but have now decided that I cannot accept the levels of incompetence any longer. They seem to think that saying sorry fixes everything and it of course doesn’t! A prime example of the sort of service that you can expect to receive from this company is as follows: At 6:13PM last night I received an automated message telling me that I had apparently requested to activate SmarterStats on my site!!! News to me! I naturally phone their support line first thing today to ask why this was and after waiting 50 (yes FIFTY) minutes on hold on their automated phone queuing system listening to a voice saying “we are sorry to keep you waiting, your call will be handled shortly”. After 50 minutes at my cost, I gave up! I then tried again after lunch and was kept on hold again for well over an hour until I had lost the will to live and decided to again hang up (Matter still unresolved). This company knows nothing about customer service or satisfaction. If they did, they would not think it was OK to keep customers waiting on hold for hors on end. This company clearly does not value its customers. I am only scratching the surface with the above as I have experienced endless problems with the ‘SiteFusion’ web software they re-sell. It is full of bugs by their own admission, such as the one where your whole websites background can completely change colour all of its own accord without you touching anything. You then phone up and they say sorry a few times and then say its not their fault because the software is from the US and they cant get hold of the development team over there! They will then offer you a month FREE hosting which you will never get the refund on!!! and the rubbish continues. They even close their own support tickets without checking that a problem has been properly resolved or send you a completely unrelated solution and then close the ticket!!! Then there is the SEO of the SiteFusion software…..nightmare! After being a 123-Reg customer for many years, I think this is especially bad. My advice is avoid 123-Reg like the plague! They don’t deserve your business! They cant be bothered to answer the phone to me!!

online support

just seen some of the other posts and i’m shocked. I logged on and within seconds I was talking to someone. he gave me easy instructions but for some reason (probably me) I couldn’t get it to work. I went back to the online support and without any prompting he offered to do it for me and within a minute my problem was solved. as far as my experience is concerned they get top marks.

123-reg excellent service and support

Hi, I recently designed a basic web page and needed it to be pointed at by my domain. Consequently the domain I had at the time would not allow access to the domain settings without paying a fee to manage the domain settings. This fee was payable annually at a cost of approximately £20. I was not happy with this so I decided to transfer my domain to 123-reg.co.uk, which provides myriads of web functions. The transfer was completed seamlessly. I then needed to point it to my website on another domain, the help pages to accomplish this were excellent I studied them but was still unsure of a few points to complete the pointing. I contacted 123 Reg.co.uk and pointed out my position and what I needed to be achieved. I asked them if they could give me further help or could they complete the pointing on my behalf, if I supplied the details. To my great satisfaction 123-reg.co.uk completed the task for me, more or less immediately at no cost. The service I enjoyed from the support team was second to none. I will be with this company permanently. I highly recommend 123-reg.co.uk

123-reg Great Support for small business

I have used 123-reg for more then 10 years, both as my domain provider and as dedicated server provider. For a small business like mine it is important that problem get solved quickly and they always do. Now as you all know 123-reg prices are amongst the lowest in the market, but the most surprising thing is that they are able to deliver almost the same value for money as companies charging many times more. And yes of cause I have experienced glitches in the system but a phone call normally solve that problem. All in all fantastic service and support, Thank You

A breath of fresh air

I transferred from another registrar with whom I was very unimpressed. The control panel is superb – it is really easy to set things up, the help pages are great and the online support staff are very helpful. The few hiccups were sorted with good explanations and I am up and running in next to no time! They even had enough information to help me set up Google apps for my domains and EFS records. Would definitely reccomend them for your domains – I can’t comment on their prices but I am sure they are value for money.

Excellent phone support

in the past I have had real hassle with 123 support – real hassle. I regretted ever signing up with 123 – I have experienced many of the problems described by other reviewers – but – today – forced by circumstance to ring 123 – I had a brilliant experience with a telephone support team member – KAM. Courteous, helpful, patient – knowledgeable – nothing was too much trouble. i feel very different about 123 at the moment! And my problems are solved.

Excellent Service

When I phoned 123-Reg I only waited a few moments before a UK based person answered and, without any fuss, my two problems were resolved immediately – you can’t ask for more! Looking at the other posts, I wonder if I was lucky?

AVOID if you can.

Support is appalling. They take there time with replying and when they do you will find you are fobbed of with a pile of lies. I have had at one point two support representatives contradicting each other over two support calls. If you are unlucky enough to be with them keep a very sharp eye on your bank account as they appear to think its fine just to take your money when they feel like it, when raised the support will deny all knowledge of this although i have bank statements showing several payments taken for the same service. I have been charged 3 times for a domain transfer that only happened once. AVOID if you can.

BE WARNED

never have i seen such a poor hosting service as reg123. Purchase of domain names is very easy this is because they want your money so they can not afford a mess up on that. The pathectic server hosting is not worth the hassle if you want down time & page errors after mapping your site/s. You may get one site working then map another or two then you get “Server Error 403 – Forbidden: Access is denied. You do not have permission to view this directory or page using the credentials that you supplied.” i have raised tick after ticket over this,spent hours deleting data bases then re-uploading only to find server error. If you want your site not to be listed in google then these cowboys are the one for you.

Poor support, complex arcane control panel

I have been using 123-reg.co.uk for about 5 years. I would have changed long ago, except that moving domains and hosting is made so difficult. Right now I have an issue with them, in which they have not renewed two domains because they say my debit card is not being accepted. This debit card is working perfectly elsewhere. I asked them to accept Paypal, which they accept for “newly registered” domains. They say they cant accept Paypal for existing hosting and domains. Does this make sense? I offered to make a transfer from our HSBC bank. Nope, not acceptable. Finally I offer to send them a cheque. Nope, not accepted. So I am stuck. I am ready to move to another provider and I know this will be a major hassle but I am fed up with the poor support from this company

Avoid Avoid Avoid

They sent me an email one day before a instant-traffic package was up for renewal, then took the money out of my account without asking. Even though this is a breach of basic consumer rights when I contacted them on the same day they refused to refund it – instead simply cutting and pasting some guff basically saying they don’t give a toss and won’t refund it (translating the management speak). I find it incredible that a company would have so little regard for their customers that they would knowing keep money for a service which you tell them you don’t want. I have had other serious problems with downtime (over 1 week solid) with this company. This meant that i was completely knocked off google searches for weeks on end – and yet they steadfastly refused to give any service refund whatsoever. I would strongly recommend avoiding them. You will regret using them the minute anything goes wrong, the minute you need to contact customer services or the minute you try to cancel your services.

Pathetic service, would not recommend

I bought several domain names from 123 about 2 months ago. I started trying to build my website using Site Fusion (123’s own website builder) last week. The first problem I had was with their ‘wide range of templates’ that actually consisted of about 4 templates in different colours. There was very little room for modification on the templates and I did not have the technical knowledge to design and upload my own PSD. I spent about an hour setting up my home page. I have had to manually edit the pictures together, resave as one large image and then upload due to the lack of flexibility. I could only put text in at one size, if I changed any of the text styles or sizes they would be reset whenever I came back. Blank lines (i.e. to break up paragraphs) were also removed everytime I refreshed the page leaving me with large blocks of monotonous text. The real kicker however was when, after 4 days solid work on my site, 123 and Site Fusion went down for two days. During this time I could not work on my website OR receive my emails. When the site started working again I logged in to find out my entire website had been deleted and I had to start over. I finished the website again and published it. I am fully aware that updating the DNS can take a while, however after 72 hours and with no response from 123’s support centre I began to worry. I also found out that my email server had been reset 4 days prior to this but they hadn’t told me so I did not receive any emails from my customers for 5 days, and only realised when one of them called me to ask why I hadn’t responded. I am unaware as to how much potential work I have lost through this ‘accident’ as customer services calls it. I am currently looking at the cost of switching to another host. Whilst I may be offline for a few days during the transfer this will be no worse then the downtime I’ve had using 123. Their service is pathetic and the customer support is non existent. Do not use, look elsewhere as 123 will just disappoint.

DONT EVER USE REG-123 OR U’LL REGRET IT

PLEASE DO NOT TOUCH OR DO ANY BUISINESS WITH REG-123. THEY ARE A TOTAL WAISTE OF TIME. I had an ecormmerce site with them for approx 6mths, made payments and all of a sudden had my site was removed by them. Their suport is none existant as all emails they send to you is from a non-reply address. I desperately tried to get my site re-instated and submitted a support request via their online-support site. To my horror one of their support poeple manually deleted the query i submitted and then later sent me an email implying that because they had not heard from me the support query had been closed. I telephoned and spent ages getting through. When I did eventually get through I was given false promises it would be looked into. To-date I am still waiting for someone to get back to me. I will be taking my business elsewhere and advise everyone to do the same.

123-reg Review

So I quite happily used 123-reg to host my site for a year. They then sent me a reminder near the end of that year saying that the hosting package was due for renewal and this would happen automatically unless I called a 0845 number to cancel it. Wanting to stop the hosting package I called it and was told the account would be cancelled. 2 weeks later they then debited my account for the renewal costs! I immediately phoned and asked for a refund and explained that I had asked for the account to be cancelled. They said that the account had never been cancelled and that was why the money was taken… brilliant. They also said that they could not give me a refund and that I would have to write to their complaints department to argue my case. I will write to the complaints department, and I will take them to small claims if necessary. I will also share my experiences (in as many places as possible!) about the quality of 123-reg.co.uk, its processes and procedures. I am NOT a happy customer.

123Reg – SUPPORT APPALLING!

At first (1month ago) this service seemed ok, I managed to get a website online and staart working on content. the problem comes when you buy advanced features (Google Analytics, e-commere, Optimizatiion etc) and require support. As mentioned in the previous post, somebody just replies with a completely different answer with a few words from your original query – then nothing! These guys are complete cowboys and I am absolutley gutted that i have purchased an Instant traffic package at £115, only now to have to go and trajnsfer domains and site etc! Thank god I got my hosting services from OVH instead, I now have the labourius task of migrating my site and domains over but at least I have seen their true colours relatively early. Be warned, especially if your a using it for business purposes! 123reg are the worst i have come across in my career.

VERY poor support

So far waiting a day now with no answer from support. They make a big thing about ‘UK based support’ which seems to mean you might get an anser about 12pm but other than that there is no one in the office. Answers they do give are not the answer to the question you ask but just a cut and paste from their FAQ section that has a couple of the same words as your question in it. I’ve asked the same question three times and still no one has actually read what I have written. The support phone line on 0871 230 9525 is only open 9 til 5 which is also very poor. They may be cheap but their support and poor back/admin area are clearly the reason why.

watch out when renewing

I tried to renew my hosting with 123-reg – D’oh — and ended up getting charged not once, not twice but for four hosting packages! Their ecommerce solution for charging a stored card makes it easy to do. I thought this bad enough but the hosting package never appeared on my account and my site was down for over a week before I got it rehosted elsewhere. Two months later I am still trying to get a full refund.

1 out of 10

I used 123-reg and recommended them until last year or two. I am now moving all sites else where. They switched off my ftp access mid development of one site- on complaining they said they’d emailed me several times (none recieved) to tell me the hosting had expired. They then continued to host the site. On trying to renew hosting their ‘secure’ billing managed to take four random amounts from my account and after complaining they’ve refunded random amounts which are substantially smaller than those taken.

Poor Support

Dont touch this bunch of monkeys. It was OK for a while until I needed support and then things just disintigrated out of control. I would ask a question on-line and I would get a completly diferent answer. I asked for a refund and got loads of rubish answers like I sined up with a new provider. Yes I f***ing did.

Great but not enough space

I opened my webpage about 9 months ago, and the only downside I have found with them is the lack of web space and bandwidth available. The website has been been reliable and the email is good. The customer support is great and they would keep my custom if they offered enough web space and bandwidth for me. I have photos online but with limited web spce have to make most of them low res and can;t stream any video or audio due to a lack of bandwidth. Their main downfall is a lack of webspace or bandwidth. They are great for a small website, but high end multimedia ones it is not great for.

Awful 123-Reg

I am having nightmares with 123reg my site has been down for two weeks. I think hosting 1 is full and have just been going round in circles. Because of the business model the managers are not customer facing which means you will never be able to speak to anyone with an responsability ever. They just dont care about the customer.

Paul

123-reg has now been down 3 days since 6th May 2008. I can’t get any e-mails and my site isn’t visable. Support desk don’t answer any calls. Make your own mind up if this is the service you’d expect.

How Can They Be So Bad

This is undoubtedly the worst IT company I have ever had the misfortune to deal with. Their Web Site Build failed, I coudn’t connect to the Support centre beacuse of an error in their system I couldn’t contact support via telephone (9am-5pm mon-fri only). They didn’t answer their phone monday morning and so I cancelled, only to find they wouldn’t refund my (annually in advance) hosting fee and didn’t answer a single email asking them to transfer my domain name to 1and1 (I had to pay Nominet to do it!). 123-reg are simply awful. I hope people read this review before they commit to such a bunch of cowboys.

Poor Service

I have been waiting 8 days now for a reply from customer service/help section. Non existant! All you get is auto-replies. Even after calling cusotmer help line 10p/min they say they pass onto the “engineers”” – still nothing done.”

a waste of time and money

Tech support diabolical, never return emails or phone calls, homepage cannot be found most of the time.